Education has many problems and also a few successes. But something called “standards” which are measured by various metrics, seem to be falling no matter what the intervention.
Frankly I think that education tends to be authoritative and rote because it's easier. Pointing to a book is easier than taking kids through a standardized course is a lot more replicable and measurable, which are the important points if you want to give everyone a "fair shake".
In order to avoid having to explain yourself, it becomes more important to be fair than right - the telltale sign of a bureaucrat.
This piece by WHYNOTTHINK was excellent. You and Gatto were spot on. I would have expected a comparison between well-informed and literate adults and lower-level kids would be stark. Right out of college, I taught in a spiffy, new school on the Upper West side of Manhattan. Five thousand students on triple session, ninety percent of whom were minorities. Truancy was rampant and expected. So was the failure rate. Even in my senior economics classes, around half failed. There was nothing any of us could do about it. Many Teachers were cynical and burned out. After two years I left the city for greener pastures.
Education in America is a fascinating subject, that I think underlies all else, and especially all problems in our country. It would really be a contribution to hear more about your teaching experience. You said "spiffy new school" so can that mean there was no deficiency in material or the school buildings?
That is the main argument about education, either the building and materials are holding the students back. The old curriculum too. Or that kids have different aptitudes, which of course is obvious. Unfortunately there is a long history (100's of years) of segregating students, supposedly by ability, but always turning out to be by race.
How about the teachers in your first school? You were right out of college, so you were certified and trained. But many urban schools have difficulty staffing teachers and they hire non-teachers, either that have experience in their field of study, but not in education, or other new ones that want to "try their luck" at teaching. Some students never have a teacher for some subjects, but only a raft of substitutes, each one lasting a week.
After two years, did you still teach in the public school systems, or you went to private?
There are many writings we are studying about education. Both Gatto, and you were in the roughest environments possible.
Here are some anecdotes about success from Chapter 6 Mike Rose:
These successes were all in marginal (poor) schools. He paints the opposite picture from Gatto. Anecdotes are not a general theory, nor are they what is happening in 91,000 schools. Here is another link about Mike Rose in a cross post on Why Not Think:
The above showed up in spam. I don't remember what I wrote. So a few quick comments.
One of the most common comments I heard in education courses was to "take into account individual differences." It makes total sense. Most elementary schools put kids in math groups and reading groups. If everyone was taught at the same level, the slower kids would be lost and the brightest kids would not learn anything.
Thanks for asking about my post-New York teaching. I got a job teaching the children of miliary personnel stationed overseas - in Germany and then Okinawa. Working for the Federal government was a great deal in so many ways. The American world-wide military empire was extraordinary, and I was able to benefit from the Cold War. I watched in amazement on the first day as the high school kids filed into the auditorium on Okinawa, took their seats and listened to the orientation, relatively unsupervised. I had escaped from New York and was living on a semi-tropical island etc. I could go on and on about my overseas life.
Brandeis High School in New York was a great facility; we had all the materials we needed. It was built on west 84th because it was terrible, crime and drug infested neighborhood. After the late session ended at 5:15, teachers did not stay after to run thing off etc. We headed home. Actually, I often headed for graduate school, and then took the subway home.
I do want to look at those cross posts. I spend a lot of time on my own pieces; my self-imposed schedule is every four days. I'll try to again send an education piece I had in the Denver Post. I'm also going to post a new one in a little over a week. Followers are trickling in, and I try to connect with them, etc, etc.
Frankly I think that education tends to be authoritative and rote because it's easier. Pointing to a book is easier than taking kids through a standardized course is a lot more replicable and measurable, which are the important points if you want to give everyone a "fair shake".
In order to avoid having to explain yourself, it becomes more important to be fair than right - the telltale sign of a bureaucrat.
https://argomend.substack.com/i/134441890/bureaucracy-the-power-that-waxes
This piece by WHYNOTTHINK was excellent. You and Gatto were spot on. I would have expected a comparison between well-informed and literate adults and lower-level kids would be stark. Right out of college, I taught in a spiffy, new school on the Upper West side of Manhattan. Five thousand students on triple session, ninety percent of whom were minorities. Truancy was rampant and expected. So was the failure rate. Even in my senior economics classes, around half failed. There was nothing any of us could do about it. Many Teachers were cynical and burned out. After two years I left the city for greener pastures.
Hello Fred Singer:
Education in America is a fascinating subject, that I think underlies all else, and especially all problems in our country. It would really be a contribution to hear more about your teaching experience. You said "spiffy new school" so can that mean there was no deficiency in material or the school buildings?
That is the main argument about education, either the building and materials are holding the students back. The old curriculum too. Or that kids have different aptitudes, which of course is obvious. Unfortunately there is a long history (100's of years) of segregating students, supposedly by ability, but always turning out to be by race.
How about the teachers in your first school? You were right out of college, so you were certified and trained. But many urban schools have difficulty staffing teachers and they hire non-teachers, either that have experience in their field of study, but not in education, or other new ones that want to "try their luck" at teaching. Some students never have a teacher for some subjects, but only a raft of substitutes, each one lasting a week.
After two years, did you still teach in the public school systems, or you went to private?
There are many writings we are studying about education. Both Gatto, and you were in the roughest environments possible.
Here are some anecdotes about success from Chapter 6 Mike Rose:
https://brax.me/f/6-203-2RoseBerea.pdf/T4AZ660a62260e0d85.20764868
These successes were all in marginal (poor) schools. He paints the opposite picture from Gatto. Anecdotes are not a general theory, nor are they what is happening in 91,000 schools. Here is another link about Mike Rose in a cross post on Why Not Think:
https://whynotthink.substack.com/p/5-u2e-cross-post-from-my-site-this
(another link to chapter 10 is in this post.)
I believe that you could add a lot of first hand experience to our discussions on education. I can get more articles cross-posted onto WNT.
What do you say?
.
The above showed up in spam. I don't remember what I wrote. So a few quick comments.
One of the most common comments I heard in education courses was to "take into account individual differences." It makes total sense. Most elementary schools put kids in math groups and reading groups. If everyone was taught at the same level, the slower kids would be lost and the brightest kids would not learn anything.
Thanks for asking about my post-New York teaching. I got a job teaching the children of miliary personnel stationed overseas - in Germany and then Okinawa. Working for the Federal government was a great deal in so many ways. The American world-wide military empire was extraordinary, and I was able to benefit from the Cold War. I watched in amazement on the first day as the high school kids filed into the auditorium on Okinawa, took their seats and listened to the orientation, relatively unsupervised. I had escaped from New York and was living on a semi-tropical island etc. I could go on and on about my overseas life.
Brandeis High School in New York was a great facility; we had all the materials we needed. It was built on west 84th because it was terrible, crime and drug infested neighborhood. After the late session ended at 5:15, teachers did not stay after to run thing off etc. We headed home. Actually, I often headed for graduate school, and then took the subway home.
I do want to look at those cross posts. I spend a lot of time on my own pieces; my self-imposed schedule is every four days. I'll try to again send an education piece I had in the Denver Post. I'm also going to post a new one in a little over a week. Followers are trickling in, and I try to connect with them, etc, etc.
What kind of work do you do?
All the best,
Fred
I am retired. I used to be in international sales, in several fields.
(Of course this post was a spoof - I think you understood that.)